The Best 25 Players Who Are Not in the Hall of Fame
Published: 14th Dec 11 10:40 am
The Hall of Very Good?
1 of 26
AP
After years and years, Ron Santo finally got the call. Too bad he isn't around to cherish it.
Baseball's Hall of Fame is the only Hall of Fame that matters. It seems the NFL and NBA allow 9 guys in a year. Baseball's Hall of Fame is a lot more prestigious. So prestigious in fact, that these great players can't get in.
Here are the 25 best players that aren't in baseball's Hall of Fame.
I used OPS+ and ERA+ because it's the easiest way to compare eras and ballparks. 100 OPS+ is considered average.
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Big Mac shouldn’t get in the hall of fame. Not because of juicing…but because he wasn’t that good of a player when you look at other facets of the game.
He wasn’t a good baserunner, and he wasn’t a good first basemen. He didn’t hit for average, and he didn’t drive in runs that support the power hitting numbers. OBP and home runs is not reason to call someone elite.
Big mac is one of the best POWER HITTERS of all time, but when it comes down to it- that’s all he was and he had a very nice career. Nothing wrong with that.
Rose overrated? This guy Lutz probably did not even saw him play. If this article was supposed to be funny, I’m not laughing. I think this guy is a ….!
You’re right – he probably never saw Rose play. If he had, he would know that Rose was nearly always the best overall player on the field. Not power, not speed, but baseball sense and hustle. Taking extra bases himself. Throwing behind runners. In the process, he got alot of hits and scored alot of runs. Overrated? There is nobody like him today.
lol you have in the list Bagwell and u praise him but Dish on Rose WOW there was a reason he was named charlie hustle he was a Titan player with the drive and determination of the Most elite that have ever stepped foot on the field he was in there to make things happen bar none and he did–skipp the B.S. and finally put the man were he needs to be inshrined in cooperstown…
Is this guy serious? I am no Pete Rose fan, but what the heck is this clown talking about here? “Pete Rose is overrated” is one of the most ridiculous statements of all time. Me being a Raider fan, I am used to people being biased because of some petty influences, but this is way beyond even that. Put down the keyboard man, you are hopeless.
gilgerard….
couldn’t agree more with you on BigMac…steroids aside…just over 1600 hits and a lifetime BA of .263 does not equal HOF.
I agree with Ted Simmons. It looks like most of Simmons’s career could have been overshadowed by Fisk. They have VERY similar stats, and Simmons couldn’t even make it through the first round of voting.
Sort of wrong on all of this. Rose as the most overrated player of all time? Your kidding me right? Looking past steroids? If we let McGwire in and Palmeiro, that’ll open up the floodgates for Bonds, Anderson and Canseco. Shoeless Joe?? Its a shame he bet, but he bet, and tarnished the game.
Joe Jackson was accused. His numbers in the series speak differently
Yes, Jackson hit .368 in the Series and fielded flawlessly. He tried to return the money he was given and was rebuffed.
Rose is considered one of the “best players of all-time” that’s why he is overrated. I would take 100 to possibly 150 players over Rose. Yes, I will look past steroids, who knows who was on them and who wasn’t. It’s all but an ERA, and in that ERA, these guys were the best.
And who cares if JJ allegedly bet, he’s still one of the best ever.
Look, if your gonna include Mac and Palmeiro thats fine. I disagree with that but your entitled. But to call the all time leading hits leader overrated and then bash him for betting on baseball, and then go on and say that shoeless joe should be in the HOF when he allegedly betted on baseball too is just ignorant. Pick one side of the argument or another, and stick with it
Mr. Lutz, as a former Physical Education Teacher, Head Collegiate Coach, it is just my opinion, that your opinion of Pete Rose, is like choosing Jennifer Anniston as the sexiest woman of all time, YOUR JUST TOO YOUNG TO KNOW BETTER! I don’t mean – to be demeaning, but the truth of the matter is … I was a Chicago Cubs Fan for many years..(still kinda am, but live in Arizona so), and when a person makes a statement like you did regarding Pete Rose, whom I doubt you ever saw play ( I did and many times), you would have to be inexperienced in your “viewing” of players. Your just going by what you hear, and guessing at the outs he made, which was rare!!! He hurt the Cubs and many other teams throughout his career.
If you think Mark McGuire should be on that list, with a .260 something BA. what are you thinking with a man that has one of the all time leading batting averages playing on what many call the greatest team ever assembled in baseball – the Cincy Reds of the 70s with Johnny Bench, Joe Morgan, Perez, and players. I speak as an outsider who followed baseball for many years… His personality wasnt the best, but he was a winner that sprinted to first on a walk…(hence the nick “Charlie Hustle”) which I think you wouldn’t know about. The head first slide was practically his trademark! Plus, when we teased him, one game when all of us bleacher bums from the 60s moved to right field, he proceeded to plunk a homer in our laps – literally in mine, to beat the cubbies 3-2.
Just another youngsta, who needs to think and research more before you rip into a ball player that many feared. Yea, I disagree with you on this…and a few others…but this, your way off young man!
This is a very subjective pole.
Where is Don Mattingly on this list. He had possible the best 7 seasons of
any first baseman not named Gahirg or Pujols. Add to that 9 consecutive gold gloves and an MVP award.
Joe Jackson took money to throw a series. The World Series. He didn’t bet.
But he didn’t throw the Series. Errorless fielding and a .368 average say otherwise.
i dont know if you ever heard of the greatest player of the 1980s,
but he is always left off these lists…
his name was don mattingly!
not to mention the fact that he is arguably the greatest fielding 1st baseman of all time, nobody seems to remember how dominant he was, if not for his bad back, he would have been one of the all time greats,
but the hall of fame isnt just about stats of longevity, its also about dominating an era of the game, only 1 player can be compared during the 1980s, and thats george brett (a hall of famer). becoming a full time addition to the line up in 83, he combined hits power and batting average in a way that had not been seen since the old days of the game. look him up on baseball reference and try to find another player that put up numbers like his during that decade.
thanks
james
Number 26 ought to be Maury Wills.
Wills’ many athletic achievements tell the story of a true sportsman and team player, including:
National League Most Valuable Player (MVP) in 1962
Shortstop of the Year in 1970-71 Season, at age 39
Golden Glove award for Fielding in 1961-62 season
Honored as Outstanding Fielder among National League Shortstops
“SPORT” Magazine’s man of the year
S. Rae Hickok Pro-Athlete Award
Wills’ accomplishments are even more meaningful when we remember that it took him nearly 10 years in the minors to break through to the majors in 1959. In fact, after 13 years in the majors, at the senior age (in baseball terms) of 39, he was still batting an impressive 288.
Maury changed the way baseball was being played at the time. He made the game more exciting to watch.
Barry Bonds??
The list would be credible with the inclusion of Jim Kaat. Check his career stats. Without Kaat on the list, it’s just that, another list.
JJ didn’t allegedly bet, he admitted in court that he took a bribe to throw the WS. While I agree he was one of the best ever, I care if he bet.
How in the World is Rick Reucshal not in the top 25? 214 wins, lifetime ERA at 3.37, over 2000 K’s, 2 time Gold Glove winner and 3 time All-Star! I would think a guy with those stats belongs in top 10!
Ever check out Vern Stephens’ stats? For 10 years, he probably had the best stats for a shortstop in his era. Yes, some of those years were in the war years, but 1948 through 1950 were great years with at least 130 RBIs each year. I honestly do not know why he is not in the hall of fame. In the year 1950 Phil Rizzuto won the MVP. If you compare Stephens’ stats to Rizzuto’s, I don’t know why he won it. That year, Stephens had 30 homers, 144 RBIs and hit 295. Overall, Stephens had the stats to be put into the hall of fame compared to his peers at the time..
Thank you for your time.
thanks for the interest on 26 players -tramell and whitker probabley should be in just for the double plays next to evers and chance are the best to play for one team and as steriods are concern they have no place in any sports its about stewardship and playing with what talent your born with its called integrity.
What about Mark Grace? 4 time gold glove. 305 lifetime batting average. Had more hits and doubles than anybody else in the 90′s. The only other person to lead a decade in hits and not be in the Hall is Pete Rose. Not counting the 2000′s.
No way for Palmiero….he was never the best player on his team. He played a long time…big deal.
How about Reggie Jackson being in the hall of fame. He could not catch a cold in the outfield, struck out more than anyone in the history of the game, and his BA was arround .250. If that clown can get in, then put all 25 on the list in.
Pete Rose was not over rated for the same reason you think Ted Simmons is under rated. Offense only tells half of the story. Ted Simmons suck behind the plate. Pete rose could play almost any position, started at six differnt positions on the allstar team, and oh, by the way holds more hitting records than any other player.
I almost stopped reading when I read Pete Rose was the most overrate player! Seriously? That is the second most absurd thing about the article. The first?
DALE MURPHY….7 all stars, back to back MVP, 4 straight silver sluggers, 5 gold gloves. I would argue that Pete Rose not withstanding, Dale, Jack Morris, and Tim Raines are the 3 biggest snubs for the hall.
What about Don Mattingly? Look at his numbers compared to those of Kirby Puckett, they are almost identical! Mattingly was one of if not THE most feared hitter for 6 seasons. Not to mention being one of the best defensive first basemen in baseball history. Injuries surely kept his production down and out of the HOF, but why off of this list?
Alright, first off. This isn’t a scientific formula I am using, it’s an opinion just like all yours are.
I’ll keep it some what short.
1) Overrated isn’t a bad word. Stop treating it as so. Is Pete Rose a Top 100 hitter of all-time? It depends what you prefer in a player. I like power, on-base skills, and run producers. I don’t like single hitters. Rose is a singles hitter.
2) Did someone really say Don Mattingly had 7 of the best season a 1B ever had? My God
3) Of course they’re going to be omissions. Katt is a lot like John. If you think Wins matter, then Kaat easily could be included. Plus, his 16 GG’s are nothing to sneeze at.
4) Dale Murphy is a good add. He could easily be included.
5) No I didn’t see Rose play, nor did I see half these guys plays. I’m willing to bet every single one of you having a fit that Rose is on here is 45 or over. There are different type of fans for baseball. I prefer statistics.
6)Fair point, Alan.
7) Whoever said Vern Stephens wins an award. I am actually shocked he wasn’t in the HoF. I must have completely overlooked him when researching.
9) Mark McGwire has a higher OBP than Pete Rose. Think about that.
10) Thanks for your comments.
This is the second idiotic article I have seen on this site, and I have only been here 4 times. I wont be back to read any more ridiculous, uneductaed remarks from anyone like Lutz. Pete Rose – overrated? Were you born without a brain or just lost it recently? Its obvious you didnt see him play as you stated, but you obviously didnt see any video of him, hear comments from his teammates in the past like Mike Schmidt ( greatest 3rd baseman of all time) who has reoeatedly said Pete should be in the Hall of Fame. The HOF is a joke and unvalidated without Rose. How can the all time hits leader not be in? Just so you know, that is only one of the many many reason he should be in. Lutz has no credibility with this statement
Ah Tim. The man with sports knowledge a mile long and an ocean deep. I’m sure you’ve never been wrong, am i right?
The issue is, he’s not wrong here. This “article” is a load of crap.
Rose was the best hitter I ever saw in over six decades of watching baseball.
Did you not see Bonds? Pujols? Ramirez? Thomas, Robinson, Bagwell? Or any of the ridiculous amount of better hitters than Rose?
Hits + hustle ≠ one of the best players of all time.
Rose was a very good player, someone I would have loved to play for my favorite team. However, a batter’s number one priority is to not make outs. While Rose excelled at getting base hits, he is not one of the best in history at getting on base. That’s a huge difference.
Rose had a fantastic career and was able to last longer than most, but claiming he was the best hitter you’ve seen in 60 years is ridiculous.
What about Dale Murphy? And check out the stats on Cecil Cooper. One of MLB’s premiere hitters in the late 30′s and early 40′s. He was injured during WW2, and when he returned to baseball, was never quite the same. Had he died during the war, he’d already be enshrined.
what about Dave Parker – the cobra. For about ten years the most feared hitter in baseball. Also had the best arm in baseball . Could have been a dh in the American league was great – not just good
Pete Rose is the type of player who accomplishments just dont stand up to modern analysis used today. It’s polarizing because these are the players you grew up with but when you look at the facts you cannot avoid the inevitable truth. Pete Rose is by far one of the most overrated Hall of Famers.
Here are some facts about Pete Rose
> His career OPS of .784 compares today to the likes of Brian Roberts, Ray Durham, Rickie Weeks, and Shane Victorano.
> His career wOBA of .353 compares today to the likes of Andre Either, Brian McCann, Nelson Cruz, and Nick Swisher.
Now, these are not bad players by any stretch, but Hall of Fame worthy? Not even close. I used recent players to put Pete Rose’s actual production into prospective. When you apply his numbers into modern metrics they just aren’t up to snuff.
Pete Rose had a terrific batting average but that is ALL he had. In today’s world modern analysis treats batting average as largely irrelevant.
I understand you watched him play and loved his style, but you cannot let things like that cloud your judgment and be above factual evidence. Eye create biases and we all love to reminisce on how things were in the “good ol days”, but these is a case where perception is not reality.
Didn’t think of Don Mattingly, Mark Grace or Dale Murphy. Good Players all.
Agree on Whitaker and Trammell. They played twice as long as Tinker and Evers and were far, far better.
Joe Jackson should get into the Hall before Pete Rose. Jackson was a personal vendetta by Commissioner Landis, who hated Southerners and Jackson in particular. He hated Ty Cobb too, but he was afraid of him. ChiSox owner Charles Comiskey was also culpable as he knew what was going on. He turned Jackson away when Joe went to him for guidance. When things broke loose, Comiskey acted like the aggreived party when he was actually as guilty as Gandil and Risburg.
I believe Jack Morris belongs in, and also Mickey Lolich. Lolich was the all time left-handed strikeout king when he retired, and he should have won the Cy Young in 1971 when he won 25 games.
Lee Smith???
Rose is without a doubt the BEST PLAYER NOT in the Hall of Fame. However, he bet on baseball, therefore, he should never be in the hall of fame..
When I read the comments about Rose I decided to respond and not even go any further to see the other three…. Decided author was uninformed, did substandard research and not worthy of any more of my time. Your words about Rose were your opinion now you have heard mine.
Opinion or not – Brian Lutz should be doing the weather, not a baseball list such as this.
He has NO CLUE to the game.
Pete Rose should not be in the Hall until the rules are amended. BUT – he was a GREAT hitter and legendary player.
McGuire and Palmiero do NOT belong in the hall, period. Ban a guy for gambling but not for steroid use?!? Moronic.
Stats are NOT what baseball is all about, as Lutz thinks. Never saw so-and-so play? Too bad…if you had you would realize how much a player such as Pete Rose contributes to a game BEYOND his numbers.
Reggie Jackson’s in there – how many strikeouts did HE have? A lot. Babe Ruth? A lot.
…and just to make a point – I’m not over 45….try 32.
Consider yourself lucky that you’re getting PAID for this crap you write.
I’m sure rant Sports will pay you too Randy K. Why don’t you write and show us the talent and knowledge you say you possess? You might want to try spelling big mac’s last name right. Just sayin’
I’m convinced now, Pete Rose is the best baseball player that has ever lived.
Interesting that Gil Hodges is pictured with Wheaties after singing the praises of juicing cheaters Palmeiro and McGuire (watched Palmeiro in the early days with the Pittsfield, MA Cubs and followed him into the majors). Hodges in, the other two bums never. Oh, and by the way, Shoeless Joe tried to win the 1919 series by himself (never took any of the money, just kept his mouth shut and spoke with his bat and glove on the field) and got shafted by the White Sox, Commissioner Landis and the insult continues today with the HOF. Rose, Palmeiro, and McGuire should have to wait as long as Shoeless Joe and then some.
I read some of the other comments, & everyone has an opinion. However, Pete Rose is overrated? That is just plain stupid. Sorry! & no I definitely am not a Rose fan, not at all. But, give the man his due, like everyone is saying there is a reason he is Charlie Hustle. He made things happen! Made things happen for his team to win. Look how long he did this & kept on knocking the ball where no one could reach it. Play him anywhere you needed him, just suit him up. No way he doesn’t belong in the HOF. Yes, I guess you needed to see them play in those days. Willie Mays for example, if he played in this watered down era would have had to be paid billions of dollars in comparison to the rest. With the pitchers he would be facing? he would hit 1000HRS, bat 400 every year. just sayin
Message to Scott- I agree with you sir on about everything you had to say & well put. One item I take exception with is, the 70s Cincy Reds were not even the greatest team of their era. That would be the 70s Oakland A’s, look it up pardner, only the old Yankees were as good. But yes, those guys were great.
Can’t believe I’m wasting my time writing this scribe when he couldn’t be reached by common sense as he was hacking away on his keyboard creating this tripe.
But seriously, What kind of an idiot makes a case for McGwire who raped standing records of respected players, through the use of hormones…. and dismisses Charlie Hustle for gambling.
Certainly you’ve written better in the past. This one lacks rational thought.
You are a fool.
this guy just created a controversial topic that is to ruffle one’s feathers,and, he has done exactly that.pretty smart if u ask me. this list could be the best 125 players that are excluded from the HOF and there would still be valid and invalid justifcations for each player excluded .hey man,if you want attention,create a somewhat subjective topic that is emotionally charged, and then wait for the arguements. whether u agree with his list or not,he has done what a writer should do,bring attention to the article,create controversy and discussion amongst baseball fans everywhere. job well done
Thank-you for being one of the few people to acknowledge the fact that Big Mac, despite what he was doing(with the league’s knowledge and probable support)saved baseball.
He can be compared to the soldier who serves and then once the battle is over, gets shunted aside with no recognition.
Enhancements(whether he took them or not)were a part of the game, always have been, always will. Put the savior of baseball where he belongs
Pete Rose is overrated because even though he had more hits than anyone else, he made more outs. Oh, I see, it’s like how Cy Young was overrated because he had more losses than anyone else. Reggie Jackson was overrated because he would at the time strike out more than anyone else. Willie Mays was overrated because he hit into more double plays. It’s a lot easier to type those lines than to say them outloud. Or it’s longevity detriment? Like the Cy Young claim, or how Aaron’s homeruns weren’t as good as Ruth’s because Aaron was able to play longer. You do realize that playing longer is actually generally considered impressive, right?
Anyway, if you want Shoeless Joe, you need Eddie Cicotte. 585 winning percentage, 2.38 ERA, an MVP, a no-hitter, a 1.154 Whip, threw the series or not, he is one of “the best players not to be in the hall of fame.”
What about Dale Murphy? He meets some of the same criteria as the players on this list, but he is one of the best people to ever play the game – a true gentleman. Maybe not a HOF career, but isn’t that what we’re talking about here?
I think some of you guys are having a problem with the word overrated. It doesn’t mean Rose sucks, it just means some people placed a higher value on him than they should have. Like when people call Derek Jeter overrated. He’s still a fantastic player, but he’s been transformed into this mythical figure that can do no wrong, making him seem better than he really is. I think that’s more what Bryan is getting at with Rose.
The comments on this article tend to show the latter. Everyone agrees Rose was a good player, the debate is on how good he was. And depending on what evidence you use, he can be considered to be overrated or overvalued.
That’s not a bad thing, it’s just a matter of perception.
Wait a minute. So, you give Mac and Palmeiro a pass for cheating and lying about it, but bash Rose, even though he is only guilty of one of those accusations? How hypocritical.
I won’t beat a dead horse about Rose, but I will say that from 67-76 he was a machine when came to manufacturing runs and getting on base.
I never said anything about giving Mac or Palmeiro a free pass. In fact, I never even brought either of those guys up, so I’m not sure why you’re replying to me with that comment. All I said was that a player can be talented, productive, AND overrated, which apparently some people have a hard time distinguishing. Overrated doesn’t mean a player was bad.
And I’d go even further and say Rose was a beast from 65-79
Sorry, Mark. That was supposed to be a reply to the original article. D’oh!
For the record, I actually agree with your points, including Rose’s prime. No idea how I forgot his .331/.418/.430 triple slash in ’79.
First of all, I am amazed at how people are reacting to this article. The writer is presenting an opinion. It is as if he is saying the best color in his opinion is red. You may disagree with him, but that does not make him incorrect, because an opinion is inherently never wrong by definition. And certainly this is no place for personal attacks. Everyone loves to play internet tough guy and rip into someone they don’t know or will never have to meet.
Secondly, Pete Rose is overrated in a sense. Pete Rose is great because he was a good hitter, and at a few points a great hitter, for over two decades. Very few people even play that long, let alone remain effective for that amount of time. His pure numbers compilation of hits makes him a strong hall of fame candidate, but that’s just it. He’s a counting stats guy. He has a career OPS+ 118, pretty good for any player. Unfortunately for Rose, he played mostly corner outfield and corner infield, positions flooded with good hitters. Nick Markakis has an OPS+ of 117, Mike Sweeney 118, Rusty Greer 119, all pretty good players, but none of them should be hall of famers. But none of them did what Rose did, remained effective for 20 some odd years, and that’s what sets him apart from them. Not that he was so much better, but because he was so good for so long.
And I think Lutz may have phrased it poorly when he said baseall was about statistics. Baseball is about watching, or playing, and enjoying the game. Seeing your favorite team win, or your favorite player hit a home run, there’s almost no better feeling. But at the end of the day, the best way to compare players, to see who is worthy of the Hall of Fame, you need to use statistics. They’re unbiased and they don’t care about anything the player did off the field or on it. That’s how players should be evaluated. Sure there are intangibles, but most of those things come from biases in opinions for players. Did Pete Rose hustle a lot? Absolutely. But so does Juan Pierre. Anyone think he should be in the HoF for his extra effort? I sure as hell don’t. This isn’t to say Pete Rose isn’t a damn good player. He’s the game’s career hits leader for Chrissake. Of course he should be in the Hall. But at the same time, he certainly is overrated.
The fact that Dale Murphy is not on this list is appalling. Dick Allen? Jack Morris? Just his civic work in itself merit inclusion. We need to look past the infalted numbers of the last 20 years and use those 20 as a magnifying glass to see how impressive Murph really was.
What do you mean if you remove Roger Maris’s two MVP seasons he was average? He only played 9 seasons total due to injury, but was considered one of the best all around ballplayers in baseball.