DJ Moore of the Chicago Bears Chimes in on the Quality of the CFL…

Over the past week or so, I have been dealing with the wrath of Canada. I suggested that the CFL isn’t as good as the NCAA and many CFL fans have decided to make me Canada’s worst enemy. DJ Moore of the Chicago Bears was kind enough to share his thoughts on the subject.

I asked Moore if he believed a good NCAA team could beat a team from the CFL. He said yes because the CFL is generally made up of players that aren’t as good as the top players on college teams. He went onto say that the style of football doesn’t matter, it is the quality of the player on the field. When I asked him about the difficult transition of Andy Fantuz, he said that making the leap to the NFL is difficult for anyone and Fantuz certainly is fighting an uphill battle like most other newcomers.

It isn’t just this blogger that feels this way, but an NFL player. Put that in your pipe and smoke it Canada…

Follow me on Twitter at ChicagoBearJew.


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  • ur cluelsee

    Hey dipshyt. a buddy of mine was all big 10 and a prominent cfler and scoffs at this notion. Wth would Moore know? I doubt he could name 3 cfl teams.
    Well over half the rosters on NCAA teams couldn’t make a cfl team. What you’re arguing is absurd.
    I’m Canadian and I might watch 5 hours of CFL ball a year and over 10 hours a week of NFL and at least one NCAA game. I much prefer the American game. But you are incredibly ignorant on this matter.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      DJ Moore went to Vanderbilt. If you need me to draw you a picture, it is probably one of the 15 best colleges in the United States. I am telling you what a NFL player said. You can get as angry as you want, but these are his words, not mine. Enjoy the smackdown…

      • Derek

        I don’t think that anyone would disagree that the quality of talent in the NCAA vs the quality of talent in the CFL *AT AGE 18-22* doesn’t compare and the NCAA has far more talented players. The fact of the matter is that the KIDS in the NCAA are not fully developed or mature enough to compete with MEN that are 22-34 (in their prime). I live in Chicago and have the opportunity to watch a lot of football and agree that if you take the national championship NCAA team, it would probably be a great match for the championship team in the CFL, but the comparison stops there. Football is different than basketball, baseball, soccor, etc which is why the NFL has an age requirement… to protect 18 and 19 year olds from getting hurt. NCAA players, with the exception of very few, have POTENTIAL. They come out of college with RAW talent that takes years to refine.

        • Jonathan Carroll

          You make great points, but the nation of Canada seems to disagree.

  • Paul

    Anyone with any football sense knows that the game and player of the NFL are far superior to the CFL. I personally cannot stand the forward motion or the quality of officials in the CFL.
    The thing is, this is OUR version of the game. A game we have been playing since the late 1800′s. There are great fans especially those in Saskatchewan that rival any college fans in the U.S. They are passionate about their teams.
    European soccer is far superior to MLS but MLS fans love their teams. World soccer stars don’t have to point out how much better they are. It’s a given.
    The CFL isn’t the prettiest kid in the playground but it’s our kid and to point out how ugly our kid is or how your kid is better, well, it kinda shows a lack of class. Just hand the ball to the ref, no need to spike it. Act like you have reached the end zone before.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Paul,

      I am not trying to run anything in or make fun of anyone’s game. BUT…many CFL fans were questioning my credibility. I needed to prove a point. I love football of any sort, so I am not attacking the game you love. Just stating a fact…

  • ToddM

    Very entertaining discourse folks. As a lifelong North American football fan, and playing sports much of my life, coaching, and an analyst, I must point out you folks demonstrate a focus on elements, which if the only variable(s), would have much to support your arguments. However, as you know, North American football, is a complex game, and its the most accurate understanding and assessment of those complexities that differentiates winning from loosing.

    My point, the CFL and American games are far to different to compare equally. This banter back and forth is an apples to oranges assessment, and demonstrates little to expect a competent assessment. Quote, just for example, no offence: ” the style of football doesn’t matter”? Hardly.

    Much larger field requires different skill set than that required for a much smaller field. That why there are 3 downs in the CFL – there is more space to make plays and gain yards, so 4 downs in this scenario is redundant and not challenging. Smaller field, 4 downs, as space is limited and is more challenging to gain yards – accuracy is therefore more paramount. Smaller field generally has larger and stronger players. The opposite is required on the smaller field. 3 downs also leads to more specialty teams play and hence a much larger component of the CFL game. Not to mention smaller more mobile quarterbacks excel in the CFL versus larger less mobile pocket based passers that excel on the smaller field.

    Generally speaking, faster players with endurance tend to excel in the large field CFL versus larger stronger players in the smaller field american football – obviously with statistically verifiable exceptions. This is pretty much a no brainer and is significant of difference that does not make well for a competent equal comparison when not considered.

    The shorter play clock in the CFL requires a different level of conditioning for the lineman.

    So please, stop comparing apples to Orangutans, on both sides of the border, and think about what you’re saying, and the applicability to the realities of the differences in the game. As demonstrated by the current discussion, I would not assess as capable analysts.
    Cheers,

    • Jonathan Carroll

      I appreciate your well thought-out response, but don’t you respect the opinion of a current NFL player?

      • ToddM

        I respect the opinion of everyone. That doesn’t mean agree with everyone. With all do respect to DJ Moore, information from one individual with limited NFL experience, and zero CFL experience, would be dubious to expect as able to represent expertise on a comparison of the two leagues. One source, hardly qualifies as a statistically significant opinion to adequately represent a significant large data set of information.

      • CFL Fan

        How bout asking Doug Flutie his opinion. He was a STAR in both NCAA and the CFL. Unlike Moore, Flutie has CFL experience, and I’m sure his response would be much different.as he has stated on many occasions

        Glad to see you are still trolling your own blog looking for traffic as is now the general consensus.

        • CFL Fan

          Interesting quote from John Madden “Inch for inch, Flutie in his prime was the best QB of his generation.”

          • Jonathan Carroll

            That’s a great quote. He was terrible in Chicago

        • Jonathan Carroll

          You are still here? I thought I banned you…here’s my issue with you. First you tell me my opinions aren’t warranted because I have no credibility. So what do I do? I actually interview an NFL player and he confirms my statement. That’s not good enough. You want me to interview Flutie…I’d be happy to do so. Set it up

          • CFL Fan

            Why would you ban me? Because I back up my points with evidence unilke your opinion that you call “fact” with nothing to back it up Why would you ask a guy’s opinion (Moore) who knows nothing about the CFL. That would be like me asking Barack Obama about the town bylaws of Moose Jaw, Saskatchewan.

            You’d think a guy who has a BMW could finagle an interview with Doug Flutie :)

            BTW, just by your reactions to people who shoot down your “facts” everyone knows you have no credibility. You may know the NFL (I don’t) so I can’t say, but it’s obvious you know nothing about the CFL.

          • ToddM

            Hey CFL Fan, chill, cheers, have a beer, pop, filtered water…we build credibility with each other by open exchange of ideas and knowledge.
            Cheers,

    • ToddM

      As this discourse appears the result of discussion of the ability of Andy Fantuz to stick with the Bears. There is much discussion that appears to place Fantuz competing for a wide-out spot and/or play on specialty teams. However this idea, upon assessment of facts, doesn’t make sense.

      It is well know in the CFL, and assuming then the Bears’ staff know, Fantuz does not have the explosive speed required for pure NFL wide-outs, or to get downfield with the required speed for the NFL specialty teams. That was not his place of excellence in the CFL. So, again to reiterate, an expectance (as demonstrated by comments) that somehow he can be something he is well known to not possess, doesn’t make sense. Hence, one must assume the Bears scouts, coaches, planners do not expect this from him, and have different ideas, and hence that they know what they are doing.

      Fantuz is a large slot type receiver, in which he excelled in the CFL. Regardless of speed, he has consistently shown ability to run excellent routes, read defences, turn covers inside out, and consistently catch anything in traffic. Defences have known what is going to do, but still fail to stop him. By the way, Fantuz had the second largest hands of any US college player.

      Hence, acknowledging he does not have the speed required for pure wide-out or specialty teams in the NFL, and not big enough to play tight-end, it is then reasonable to assume the Bears have different ideas. They may well be working towards integrating larger receiver packages into their offensive strategies, as has been the recent case with other recently progressive and successful NFL offences.

      It only seems logical, if there really was an expectation of him to play, they brought him in to integrate an option for using a large slot type receiver, typical of CFL, in larger number based receiver packages, to catch balls in traffic. Such an experiment, appears to demonstrate practical consideration, assuming the Bears were looking to expand and improve on their aerial offensive outputs last year.

      If this is not the case, it is reasonable to suggest that somewhere wires have been crossed, and breath, effort, and money have been wasted.

      Cheers,

      • CFL Fan

        Totally agree with the above. I would tend to think that the Bears braintrust would have been smart enough to know what they were getting. Everyone seems to think Fantuz will get the ax but I’m not sure if that is what the Bears are thinking.

        Can’t remember where I heard this but CFL GMs and scouts are licking their chops this year because of the work stoppage. Because of the shortened prep time etc they figure mistakes and difficult decisions are going to be made and some prime players are going to fall by the wayside.

        • Brett Rosin

          I wish I had a BMW…Jonathan’s is pretty nice….

          Hey CFL fan- since your such an avid fan- why don’t you come to Rant Sports and head up the CFL section. We currently don’t have one- and passionate fans such as yourself would be a great addition to the network.

          • CFL Fan

            I came here to comment on what were erroneous and later insulting comments from Johnathan Carroll (and I wasn’t alone), not to lobby for a writing position, especially at a website that would allow the type of irresponsible “journalism” I’ve seen here.

            I’ve made my points and got my own shots in, in response to the blogger. And if he is finished with what he has done you won’t hear more from me.

      • Jonathan Carroll

        Todd, your argument is very articulate. But this argument has taken on a life of it’s own

        • ToddM

          Sorry about that chief :-) Over and out.

      • David

        ToddM; I have been “away” for awhile because the dialogue, quite frankly, was degenerating. Your post is interesting and very well presented. It should have been obvious to anyone knowing anything about football, that Fantuz was not a speed demon. Certainly, the Chicago scouts and coaches should have known that about him. Andy’s strength is his ability to go up in traffic and come down with the ball. Was that what the coaches had in mind? It certainly does not seem that way. My question is, since you have spent time and money on signing him, why not give Andy a meaningful quarter (not the last 2 minutes in a blowout) in a game, running some patterns designed to exploit his talents, and see what he can do?

        • David

          As an aside, referring to an earlier post about the CIS talent pool improving. While the number of players moving from the CIS directly to NFL training camps is very small, it does seem to be getting bigger. NFL teams are becoming more aware that, at the very least, they should scout Canada in the hopes of picking up a “diamond in the rough”. A perfect example is the drafting of Vaughn Martin out of The University of Western Ontario (the same program that produced Andy Fantuz) a couple of years ago. He has improved steadily, to the point where he could start at defensive end for the Chargers (see the post below).
          http://www.chargers.com/news/article-1/Martin-makes-waves/25f9d2b4-f891-4abc-b05e-4776f79549c6

          • CFL Fan

            Does anybody remember watching the Can-Am Bowl on TV? Between 1977 and 1979, the Can-Am Bowl (a college all-star game) was played at Tampa stadium between NCAA and CIAU players. We lost all three games but weren’t embarrassed. I think we had a problem scoring points but our defenders were pretty good. It would be very interesting to see this happen today as CIS football programs are light years away from what they were then.

            There’s very little info about this on the web but I remember it from when I was a kid as it was televised nationally on CBC.

            Here’s something to jog the memory from the Tampa Sports History blog.
            http://tampasportshistory.blogspot.com/2008/01/can-am-bowl-i-1879.html

  • Luis

    U know, I think these rants are based on pure stubbornness and it’s getting old. Everyone proved their points lets move on. Carrol is told that he hasn’t backed anything he said up with facts and I understand why he is fed up with you guys. If u guys think you’ll change his mind your wrong, he went to talk to an NFL player, your fighting a lost case. Honestly all thes “facts” sound so similar about cfl. It’s annoying, and you know what else, this blog is about the cCHICAGO BEARS not the cfl!!!! And jonathon carrol, why do you even b

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Thanks Luis. We’ve got much bigger fish to fry like the Packers

  • Luis

    Bother with thesE guys, their not worth it. And you guys who bother him, your points were heard and make sense but havnt u had enough of this. Let’s get back to the real stuff, NFL, not CFL or the NCAA. Seriously leave the guy alone, you complain that he doesn’t accept your concerns or facts but he has responded to almost all of them and from what ive seen, he’s accepted the facts and said that your facts true. Quit it, you fight for your opinion but when he defends his you go insane on him. At the same time he does the same but I’d be pretty pissed off having to deal with you losers. Don’t act like your feelings were hurt, just accept or deny his opinion, your arguments have been made. End of the discussion. Let’s move on to what everyone obviously knows is better than NCAA or any othe football league. Well leagues that I know of. GO BEARS!!!!!!!!!!!!

  • Luis

    I honestly think that the bears are in for a rude awakening. They will probably be like the cowboys. They wer amazing the year before despite some doubts but then the this year all the problems began to show. For the bears they don’t hav as much problems as the cowboys but need some sprucing up to do. They aren’t bad but just need some guys to step up, also if they drafted a top CB that isn’t short or small and is NFL ready, and another player like pouncy and mayb sign a tight end in free agent who is a beast blocker but doesn’t hav to be a reliable catcher since marts never uses them. They’d be all set. this year however will be a test of luck, or a couple guys hav a blow out season

    • Jonathan Carroll

      I’m going to disagree with you Luis. I love the defensive line. Might be the best in football.

      • Jeff Shull

        The Giants and Lions might have something to say about that

  • http://none Jim friesen

    I will not get into the discussion about whether or not Andy Fantuz will or will not make the Chicago Bears team roster for as has already been stated, our Canadian game in many aspects is very differant than the American version.
    We in Canada have played this game since roughly 1875 and introduced the pass to your game in a college game played i believe in 1898 between McGill University and a U.S. College that at that time only ran the ball.
    Canadians are extremely proud of our game. We feel the rules and the way we play along with our larger field make for a much more exciting game than your American version.
    We find it difficult to understand some of your rules which take out the excitement of the game, Namely, the touchback rule [ which punishes the kicker for an excellent kick ] and then the fair catch which again does nothing to put excitement into your game. Also our larger field makes it more difficult for the defensive backs to cover the recievers thus making for a more wide open game. There are a number of other differences that also make our game, at least in my mind much more exciting than your American version and we have played this game as long as you have or possibly even longer.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      I’m beginning to think we need to educate Canadians

      • paul

        Seriously jimfriesen, go back to the first toddm reply to understand the apples to oranges argument. It’s Chicago Bear season. Best team ever. Jonathon, don’t look at cfl fan or jimfriesen as more than two people with opinions as opposed to Canadians. It’s like thinking the tea party is what Americans are all about.

        • Jonathan Carroll

          I really don’t lump them together. But this argument has been the best thing to happen to the CFL since the invention of color tv.

          • paul

            They have color tv?

          • CFL Fan

            More than happy to bring traffic to your blog. Seeing as the “quality” of information isn’t a draw the controversy will probably be more than welcome.

            You’re an arrogant, rude, little prick (which I don’t have a problem with) except for the matter of your stupidity. You bait and insult readers and then play the victim and then try to garner sympathy by saying how all those mean Canadians are picking on me.

            Well, it’s raining this weekend and I have nothing better to do so every rude and ignorant retort of yours will be greeted with (in the words of the great JFK) a full retaliatory response.

            Wouldn’t you say this was the best thing that ever happened to your blog :)

          • Jonathan Carroll

            You’re a moronic douche that is never satisfied with any answer. I’ve interviewed a player from the NFL to answer the CFL question and that wasn’t good for you. You are a tool, moron and disgrace to the oxygen that normal people breathe.

            I’m not baiting anyone. I just think you need a fucking hobby.

          • CFL Fan

            Yeah, it’s brilliant to ask somebody their opinion about something they don’t know. Maybe Cutler is a curling expert, see if you can get his opinion on that.

            Hey just curious about the “media outlets” you worked for…Grade 8 school paper?

            As Granny Clampett would say “Johnny baby you done blown your cool” :)

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Chicago Sun Times, Pioneer Press, AOL, STATS Inc, CBS News.

          • CFL Fan

            Intern?

  • Jeff Shull

    Someone just needs to get a hold of Warren Moon to settle this debate…get on it Carroll!

    • CFL Fan

      Doug Flutie would be more than happy to give chapter and verse

      • CFL Fan

        “I’m not baiting anyone. I just think you need a fucking hobby.”

        Hmmm let’s see:
        Put that in your pipe and smoke it Canada
        You’re angry and a little stoned hoser
        Cartman was right, we should invade Canada Hoser

        Nope. No baiting, just the village idiot spouting what he thinks are Canadian insults

        • Jeff Shull

          I didn’t think you needed to sully my good comment with this retort to Jonathan…it’s not fair to Warren Moon and let’s be honest, he’s all that matters in this debate

        • Jonathan Carroll

          All in response to you douche

    • CFL Fan

      What hasn’t been mentioned in the crossfire is the quantum leap in improvement of the CIS. Many Canadian college programs are now year long professional affairs. Was it last year that seven CIS players were invited directly to NFL camps?

      Jamall Lee was invited to the Panthers on the strength of his phenomenal test scores. Sam Giguere and Cory Greenwood both stuck with the NFL directly out of the CIS in recent years.

      • Jonathan Carroll

        OMG, really. They’re taking over

        • CFL Fan

          Wow, you’re really witty, ever thought of taking up writing for a living? Actually my example of Doug Flutie to win the case of CFL over NCAA on second thought, isn’t the best.

          I said it because I knew what his response would be in regard to how good the CFL is, but his time was almost 20 years ago. And as I stated above, the talent of the Canadian college player has made a quantum leap in the time since.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Good old Warren Moon. A rare example

  • Jeff Shull

    What hasn’t been mentioned in this cross fire is that nobody cares about Canadian football…CFL fans should acknowledge their game is inferior…I’m a fan of the Houston Dynamo—MLS team, but I would never make believe the MLS is anything close to even the lower tier European Football (soccer) leagues.

    As good as we did against Canada in the last Olympic Games, I will never believe America is on the same level of Canadians in Hockey…some things we just have to accept, and America has a better brand of football.

    • CFL Fan

      Apparently you’ve been taking stupidity lessons from the blogger. I too think the USA isn’t on the same level as Canada in hockey, except the evidence is showing otherwise.

      There are some USA wannabees in Canada who say nobody cares about CFL football, except the TV ratings say otherwise.

      The NFL network decided to increase the amount of CFL games they broadcast this year, evidently they did that because it sucks so much.

      • Jonathan Carroll

        The NFL Network can only show top lists only so much.

        • CFL Fan

          Jonathan Carroll’s Top Ten Moronic Quotes to CFL Fans (from the home office in Hicksville Illinois)

          10 A top NCAA team would kick the crap out of the Grey Cup champion. End of story
          9 I have forgotten more football than you you know son
          8 The GM from Montreal is high, drunk and stupid
          7 I’m stating a fact
          6 There are so many different gimmicks to it (CFL) to cover up the fact that it isn’t good football
          5 He (Henry Burris) isn’t considered to be one of the greatest QBs in CFL History?
          4 How many copies of the video game CFL 2012 are selling here in the United States?
          3 He (Fantuz) is arrogant beyond belief
          2 I wrote this from my BMW

          And the moronic quote that started it all, at number one…
          1 Ohio State plays a tougher schedule than the Saskatchewan Roughriders.

      • Jeff Shull

        The TV Ratings for M.A.S.H. were through the roof in the 70′s…that doesn’t make it a good show. When you have no alternative to watch, you’ll watch what is provided. TV ratings in Canada do nothing for this argument.

        I haven’t been taking stupidity lessons, I’ve been teaching sanity lessons, to which I’ll offer to you free of charge.

        • CFL Fan

          “When you have no alternative to watch, you’ll watch what is provided. TV ratings in Canada do nothing for this argument.”

          Another piece of brilliance from the Rantsports Howard Stern wannabees. TV ratings mean nothing? Well, tell that to the NFL marketing machine and see what they think?

          I still see we’re getting deflected from the original argument of CFL vs NCAA

          • Jeff Shull

            You didn’t even respond to the actual point of the post. In Canada you’ll watch the CFL because that’s what is provided for you, so while the TV ratings in Canada are great…it’s ONLY because that’s what you have to watch…

            Back in the 70′s and 80′s…there were garbage TV shows that produced incredible ratings because most people had five channels and had no alternative…it’s the same idea with the CFL…you watch because you want to watch football and that’s all there is..so the ratings go up..

            The ratings obviously mean something…but that’s not the point..not surprising that you didn’t get it.

          • CFL Fan

            Please don’t make comments about Canada, because you don’t know what you are talking about. All NFL games are available and CFL ratings dwarf them. Even in the USA loving Toronto area CFL ratings are bigger. I’ve already had this argument elsewhere and if you want I’ll dig up the BBM numbers for you.

            Football fans watch the CFL by choice and the alternative is available.

            We just got cable TV last year, you know. I’m saving up to buy a colour set. Where’s your buddy, I thought he was playing the role of the ugly American.

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Your pennies need to be more original

          • CFL Fan

            I’ll make a deal with ya, you don’t tell me about the CFL and I won’t tell you about the NFL. As a successful professional business entity the NFL is superior, on that we can be unequivocably sure.

            But, the original source of the debate (that we keep straying from) was Ohio State having a more difficult schedule than the Saskatchewan Roughriders (who just fired their first year coach, after eight games) The vast majority of posters think this is untrue.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Here’s the difference Jeff. I’d say that junior hockey in Canada would kicks the living crap out of college hockey in the United States. CFL fan thinks that the CFL is on a par with the NFL.

      • CFL Fan

        “CFL fan thinks that the CFL is on a par with the NFL.” I never said any such thing. Nice try trying to deflect the argument. I would say that if athletes were offered the same amount of money and notoriety I can bet which game they would prefer. There’s a reason it’s called the No Fun League.

        The NFL is all money and hype. Four downs to get ten yards gimme a break. Again the difference is in the hype. In the CFL if a game ends 7-3, it’s a sucky game with crappy offenses. In the National Hype League, it’s called a titanic struggle among superior defenses.

        But that is just my opinion and not the original premise of the argument. The argument was that the NCAA would kick the crap out of the CFL which the majority of posters have called shenanigans on.

        • Jeff Shull

          The reason that the CFL cannot offer the money and the notoriety is because it suck! Obviously if it were a better brand of football people would be flocking to Canada..but it’s not

          • CFL Fan

            “because it suck!” What are you? 12? That’s the best explanation you can give. Is this some sort of high school kid volunteer blog?

            The US has more than ten times the population of Canada. That equates to larger numbers of people watching television for advertisers to advertise to. Each NFL team doesn’t have to sell a ticket to make money due to the TV contract. I understand there were some teams who actually would have preferred the work stoppage not end.

            For Gawd sakes, whoever runs this blog, get some adults to write for it!

          • Jeff Shull

            Well you understand wrong…the federal judge in Minnesota ruled that Owners would not have earned the $4 billion in TV deals, so everyone wanted the lockout to come to and end…again you prove you don’t know what you’re talking about…

            I already gave multiple explanations in other comments..but nothing seems to be good enough for you…have fun watching that gimmick football league of yours, at least our brand of hockey has the same rules.

          • CFL Fan

            An NFL team doesn’t have to sell a ticket any year, not just this year because of their TV contract. The bills are paid before they hit the field.

          • Jeff Shull

            Tell that to Jacksonville, who’s games are constantly blacked out on TV because they don’t sell out…you’re out of your element..just stop

      • Keith

        I think I can finally make you see the original point I made about comparing leagues using your analogy here…

        Hockey: NHL > AHL > Junior > NCAA
        Football: NFL > CFL > NCAA

        Both comparisons take into account things like money, age/experience, athleticism. I too prefer to watch CFL ball compared to American rules ball. Both games grew in parallel over the last century or so to become what they have become today. If you had a world where CFL teams could pay players and have the celebrity factor that NFL teams can offer it would be interesting to see which league players preferred.

        I imagine that QB’s, WR’s, and the rest of the skill positions would pick playing by CFL rules due to the added freedom of movement and chances for improvisation that are allowed because of the larger field and more fluid flow.

        But we won’t see that comparison ever happen. Canada has a population 1/10th of what the USA has, the economic factors that give NFL players multi-million dollar salaries don’t exist for Canadian football, the NHL is king in Canada. Even though my Saskatchewan Roughriders outsell all but 2 NHL clubs in terms of merchandise (so the fan support is there).

        And seriously, dude? What is with all the prickish replies? Unless you went to the Bill O’Reilly school of journalism you should know that slinging mud only makes you look like the pig.

        And CFL gimmicks let me see…
        - no yards rule = see 5 yard halo used in the NCAA, same thing. No wussy fair catch or ball downing.
        - 12 men = bigger field, more players (some rules of rugby allow for 15 players some for 13) and since both Canadian and American rules grew from Rugby this is a good place to start
        - larger field = another example of seperate game evolution
        - single point = doesn’t reward failure, it penalizes it for the returning team for not getting the ball out of the endzone. Imagine how many more returns there would be if you decided to touchback the ball
        -20 yard deep endzones = I prefer it, more room to make something happen in the endzone, although I think we could do just as well with 15 yard deep ones.

  • John

    In all honesty there is probably not one single player in the CFL that wouldn’t ditch their team in a heartbeat for the opportunity to play on in the NFL. Period end of discussion

    • CFL Fan

      That’s not the argument. The argument is over NCAA and CFL.

      And if they did offer CFL players the same amount of money to play in the CFL why would they move to the US and the National Felon League. Before the 80s when the Canadian dollar was at par with the greenback and the US TV contracts were not as insane as they are now, scores of American stars came up to play. It was all about money then and it’s all about money now.

      Do you honestly think an agent would advise a player to go somewhere for less money? Rocket Ismael went to Toronto because somebody “showed him the money” not because he longed to play in the NFL. And when the money was gone so was he.

      • John

        Ok how bout this, there isn’t a player in the NCAA the would go to the CFL over the NFL. It isn’t just bout the money it the ultimate dream of every footballer. Matter of fact the players the are the cream of the crop in the CFL always try to make the transition,some make it al la Warren moon, Doug flute, Kurt Warner. I know that the question was could an NCAA team beat a CFL team and the answer is hell yeah. There are some NCAA teams that I think that could beat NFL teams like the panthers or the bengals this year. So that shouldn’t even be debated. In my opinion the CFL is for the players that love football but didn’t either get the shot, had their shot, got to old, or are trying to prove themselves worthy and get something on film to show a NFL team next year.

        • CFL Fan

          “There are some NCAA teams that I think that could beat NFL teams like the panthers or the bengals this year.”

          Are you sure you want to go there (on this site). I wouldn’t say anything as crazy as that.

    • John

      Name me one star that wasn’t washed up that went to theCFL in the80′s. Don’t even mention the rocket a career 3rd stringer if your try’n to give me an arguement about the quality of CFL players vs. The NCAA

      • CFL Fan

        “Name me one star that wasn’t washed up that went to the CFL in the 80′s.”

        Tom Cousineau was drafted first overall in the 1979 NFL Draft by the Buffalo Bills, who acquired the pick from the San Francisco 49ers in a trade for O.J. Simpson. Cousineau never played a game with the Bills. He instead signed with the Canadian Football League Montreal Alouettes where they offered double the money that the Bills originally offered.

        Cousineau became a star there, becoming the Grey Cup Most Valuable Player in the 1979 season. Cousineau wanted to return to the NFL, and in 1982 the Houston Oilers attempted to sign him, but the Bills (who still held Cousineau’s NFL rights) matched the offer. He was then traded from the Bills to the Cleveland Browns for a first round draft choice (14th overall) in the 1983 NFL Draft. That pick was used on future Hall of Fame quarterback Jim Kelly. Cousineau signed a five-year contract for 2.5 million dollars, the most ever for a Cleveland Brown player at the time.

        • Jeff Shull

          LOL the key to that whole post? “He wanted to return to the NFL”

          • CFL Fan

            When they matched the CFL money, yes. Is that so difficult to understand? If the CFL is such a nothing to you why are you so threatened? Methinks you doth protest too much.

          • Jeff Shull

            Exactly…so when all things were equal..he chose the NFL…obviously if the CFL starts offering millions of dollars to these guys they are going to go there…but it won’t happen…just look at the Russian club that signed Samuel Eto’o for $30 million..you think he cares about where he’s playing? No..he just likes the momney

  • Luis

    Man, u know what someone Shuld call the head of the NCAA and the head of the cfl and play the bcs champs against cfl champs and let them battle it out, all honesty you have young amazingly athletic guys in the NCAA, against veteran professionals, some from NFL who couldn’t make it so left to exceed in cfl. Along with some players from Canadian college ball but heres my outcome.
    NCAA 63-49 wins under American rules, under canadian rules cfl wins 38-35 OT. Let’s say it’s old school with no pads except excessive thick clothing, and leather helmets in heavy mudd with a light snow, like back in the 30′s 40′s now that would be something worth watching

  • CFLman

    « As far as talent … the talent here is comparable to the NFL, it’s just consistency. These guys can run, these guys can hit, these guys know what they’re doing. » Ricky Williams, The Miami Herald may 29, 2006.

    Williams stats in the CFL, 529 yards, 109 carries, 4.8 average the lowest average in the CFL. In the CFL you need a minimum of 5 yards per carry.

    In “The complete Idiot’s Guide to football 2nd edition” Joe Thiesmann also an ex CFLer and an ex NFLer wrote “the CFL is a better league than the NFL”.

    It makes much more sense to believe American professional football players that played in both leagues (like Dong Flutie, Joe Thiesmann, Jeff Garcia, Warren Moon and many more) than a NFL player who never physically experienced the true reality of the CFL and the NFL.

    Many former NCAA stars or Heisman trophy winners are in the LCF and many more NCAA stars or former NFLers don’t make the CFL.

  • CFL Fan

    Well, here it is. THE definitive article on NCAA vs CFL. This will explain everything to our CFL dismissing blogging friends.

    All-American CFL QB busts
    They come to Canada and fail miserably
    http://www.torontosun.com/sports/columnists/bill_lankhof/2010/06/27/14539736.html

    This explains many of the reasons why a big name NCAA college star can and does fail. Any of these names sound familiar: Andre Ware, T.J. Rubley, Jason Gesser, Eric Crouch, Akili Smith, Don McPherson, Tommie Frazier, Tony Rice, Major Harris, Tee Martin, Brad Banks, Mike McMahon, Marvin Graves

    • David

      Great post. I am not sure that Jonathan will respond.

      • Jonathan Carroll

        You’ve all been wonderful in presenting your arguments.

        • Troy

          Another QB flop was Ken Dorsey who couldn’t even make the lowly Argos and was a clipboard 3rd stringer. How about Vince Ferragamo he was a disaster as well. Former NE Patriot Michael Bishop was an interception machine.

          don’t even get me started on other flops like Mark Gastineau, Dexter Manley, Andre Rison.

          • CFL Fan

            Let’s add to the list NCAA college legends Art Schlichter and Todd Marinovich

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Marinovich was an invention of the media. Art was a bust

          • Troy

            Let’s add to the list NCAA college legends umm cornhusker and heisman winner the one and only….. ERIC CROUCH…

          • Jonathan Carroll

            And… What’s your point? Tom Brady didn’t win any awards. He’d dominate your second class league

          • CFL Fan

            “And… What’s your point? Tom Brady didn’t win any awards. He’d dominate your second class league” Just like Vince Ferragamo was supposed to. You are truly the King of Moronic generalization. Tom Brady might do well, then again he might not.

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Breaking news…CFL Fan doesn’t think Tom Brady would dominate in the CFL.

          • CFL Fan

            “Breaking news…CFL Fan doesn’t think Tom Brady would dominate in the CFL”

            This just in…CFL Fan doesn’t know if Tom Brady would do well. NFL pundits said Vince Ferragamo would dominate the CFL in 1981 (as he did in the NFL in 1980) ..he didn’t.

            More details just arrived…Johnny (aka ol’ Fucko) still refuses to acknowledge article and points that makes a fool of him and his assertions. Refuses to discuss points of CFL football as he has been proven by a score of posters to be an idiot. Film at eleven!

        • CFL Fan

          Too bad you won’t reply to the many arguments presented in the article that prove the point CFL>NCAA.

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Nope. But you guys are good

          • CFL Fan

            It’s easy to be good when you’re right. If you are deluded into believing your opinion, that’s fine, I just hope you can at least acknowledge you learned something from the article.

            In fact there’s a line about you in there.

            “American kids, he says, never see Canadian football and few understand what it’s all about until they get here. It’s difficult to respect what you don’t know.”

          • Jonathan Carroll

            Sorry dude. You’re not going to convince me. But your efforts show me that you should be writing for us

          • CFL Fan

            No, my friend I could never work with somebody who refuses to learn and admit they were wrong. It’s no big deal, I could respect you if you could acknowledge the points in the article. Forget about my insults, that was part of the game, but to not learn from the pros and the people who have been there is shameful.

          • CFL Fan

            As the late great pro wrestler and former SD Charger Ernie Ladd used to say “Come sit under the learning tree”

            Here’s a name for you to keep in mind. Your ol’ buddy the high, drunk and stupid GM of the Als, Jim Popp. The next Marv Levy perhaps? Except I hope his record in the big games (when he gets to the NFL) is a little more successful.

            Also did you know that the GM of the Atlanta Falcons (Thomas Dimitroff) is a former CIS (Canadian Interuniversity Sport) football player.

    • Jeff Shull

      So guys from the NCAA went on to suck in the CFL because they couldn’t adapt to the offensive systems…I’m just curious how that makes your argument…in the article it mentions how those great athletes had systems built around them in college…news flash..the debate here is if the NCAA team could beat the CFL team…which means those guys would be playing in their system during the matchup…

      What a horrible argument…

  • Troy

    Jonathan,

    The problem with you is you generalize. Just because Dumb Jock Moore says something you take it as the Bible. Just because a young Henry Burris was brutal you stereotype all CFL’ers in the same light.

    I don’t generalize because if I did and listened to you and DJ Moore speak I would think all American are dumbasses.

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Troy,

      Moore went to and graduated from Vanderbilt. May wanna retract your comment.

      • CFL Fan

        Will you retract yours?

        • Troy

          Wave the white flag Jonathan… CFL FAN has outsmarted you, outwitted you and has owned you from the get go….

          • Jonathan Carroll

            You’re wrong. I interviewed an NFL player, he uses dated arguments

          • CFL Fan

            Let’s deal with facts. The normal kind not yours. Exactly what informatioon is dated? You’ve been riding this story for a week now and probably haven’t read the article that shoots down everything you think and say.

            You interview somebody who has as much knowledge as the team waterboy. I don’t know if you’re thinking your boxing clever by hoodwinking these Canadians to coming to your site but if you’re thinking of growing this blog, people are going to see this and what do you think they are going to do, sponsor a foul mouthed MORON?

            You’re only hope is to get money through controversy because you’ve blown it as a serious amateur reporter.

  • DaTruth

    DJ Moore might be knowledgeable about the NFL and NCAA, but he may be surprised to learn that virtually all the starting players in the CFL came from the NCAA. Were they the worst players on their NCAA teams? Hardly.

    Take the B.C. Lions, they have 7 Canadians who start (several of whom had big careers in the NCAA) and 17 Americans who start. Of those 17 American starters, they include a 1st-team All-American; an All-Conf. selection; a 1st-team Conf. selection; a Conf. H.M.; a 2-time All-Conf. selection; an All Big-12 selection; an All-Conf. 3rd-team All-American; an All-Conf. H.M.; an All-Big 10 selection; a WAC Defensive Player of the Year, etc.

    The backup QB’s include Jarious Jackson from Notre Dame and Mike Reilly, who threw a TD pass in every one of his 46 NCAA games (a NCAA record).

    These players also average 7 years of professional weight training, coaching and experience after their NCAA careers.

    This is typical of all CFL teams, the vast majority of starters were stars or at least very good players in the NCAA…many of whom have played in the NFL or were former NFL draft picks. The vast majority of CFL starters have had tryouts with NFL teams.

    There is little question the NFL gets the cream of the crop. But as we’ve seen with players like Cameron Wake, Jeff Garcia or Warren Moon, the NFL isn’t perfect in their scouting process and many excellent players go to the CFL.

    Knowing this, do you still think a NCAA team could beat a CFL team? If so, why?

    • CFL Fan

      “Knowing this, do you still think a NCAA team could beat a CFL team? If so, why?” Because it’s a “fact”, that’s why.

      • David

        Great post DaTruth. You have added important information, in the form of real facts, as opposed the kind of made up facts that have often been part of Jonathan’s posts. The problem you face is that you are travelling down the rational road and Jonathan doesn’t play there.

        • Jonathan Carroll

          David,

          Interviewing an NFL player isn’t proving a point. The CFL is a second rate league.

      • Jonathan Carroll

        I think a top NCAA team would dominate a CFL team. The size and style of play defeats your style. And of course, you then argue. So we’ll never agree

    • Jonathan Carroll

      Sigh

      • David

        Thought so.

        • Jonathan Carroll

          I’m not sure a CFL team would be an Arena team. Although your football is clearly like that crap.

          • David

            I rejoined the debate because there were several posts that were factual and informative, and yet your response has been to lower the level of discourse once again. Good night Jonathan.

          • CFL Fan

            Mr Carroll, you have been (as the kids say) PWNED! And as you say “End of story” Hope we have added some revenue to this fact starved website while proving your lack of credibility.

            Thanks for adding something new to the lexicon. We now have the ugly, STUPID, American. No offense to our reasonable, American friends.

          • CFL Fan

            I would suggest everybody here who has been insulted by Mr Carroll post a link to this page in any of his future blog posts. Let the reader know what they are dealing with.

  • Troy

    It’s pointless dealing with this MORON as he says the same old crap over and over again. The only good that came out of this useless blog was how many INFORMED and INTELLIGENT posters there were. I commend all the posters here who provided FACTUAL and WELL THOUGHT OUT, CREDIBLE information. I also applaud the American posters who have followed the game and made non biased statements based on what they saw. Not all of them were positive for the CFL game but I appreciate that because at least you watched the game so you have merit in forming your opinion. Jonathan the Doofus and Dumb Jock Moore spout off without even seeing or playing the CFL game.

    The rant we had with Jonathan was never a hate on for Americans. It was all about one dumbass making ASSININE remarks and never backing it up with real facts.

    You’ve been Pwned and I’m out…

    • Jeff Shull

      emphasizing words with capital letters doesn’t make you any smarter…in fact it makes you look juvenile

      • CFL Fan

        When you two “bloggers” decide to debate with actual evidence instead of constantly deflecting the argument you might get some respect. Until then…

        • CFL Fan

          Have either of you two Rantsports yahoos even read the article that was posted? Fucko the Clown says the info was dated (article written in late June 2010)

          What points were dated? What points did you contest and why? Why won’t you respond to the real facts and not just the insults (which I do enjoy delivering as well)

          One question did you even read the article? (I doubt it) How can anyone accept the opinion of the amateur hour clowns “writing” for this blog vs those of the paid professionals who are involved with the CFL and the NCAA (scouting and managing)

          Why won’t you repond to the football related points? Inquiring minds want to know.

          • CFL Fan

            Sorry, I just saw the high school kid may have looked at the article, how about the village idiot, have you read it yet?

          • Jonathan Carroll

            You’re a hemorroide on the ass of Canada

          • Jeff Shull

            What’s funny is you keep presenting facts and telling us we’re either in high school or junior college drop outs…with all of the clear talent you have at researching, it wouldn’t be hard to find out where I went to college on Facebook..

            I already addressed the ridiculous point you made with that article link…maybe read it before saying I dismissed it.

          • CFL Fan

            @Jeff Shull

            I have no interest in you or your moron buddy. You’ve got what looks like a high school photo. For some reason you two seem threatened by Canadian football because you have no knowledge of it.

            The Americans who come up here love it (the game) If the same salaries were offered who’d want to play in the NFL?

            Your buddy can only offer insults and no replies when it comes to the football parts of the debate.

        • CFL Fan

          “hemorroide on the ass of Canada” Are you reusing old material? Next time at least spell it correctly.

  • Garnett

    All I have to say is the CFL rocks ! I only watch CFL Its the oldest pro football game in the World and the BC Lions are World Champs !